After reading the wonderful news about the scholarships, it made me wonder... It's never been totally explained to me exactly how the grades etc work in the Jamaica schools system. Would someone mind giving a breif summary? As I know it's a little different than in the US.
In the US it's usually like this:
3-4 year olds--Pre-School
Grades K-6 (ages 5-11) Elementary School (Mandatory)
Grades 7-8 (ages 12-13) Junior High School (Mandatory)
Grades 9-12(ages 14-17) High School (Mandatory)
Then on to either Technical School, Jr. College, or College/University.
In the US you either go to private school (you pay and can go anywhere) or public and you are usually assigned as to the area you live. Can the children in Jamaica go to whatever school they choose and how is it decided which one they can attend? Is it limited in anyway, if so who decides? Is there any determination based on grades?

This may not be entirely accurate, so I invite someone else to add to what I'm saying -- or correct me where I may have made an error.

In Jamaica, the pre-school is called Basic School; it is optional. And, I believe it can even include two-year-olds.

The U.S. equivalent of elementary school is called Primary School in Jamaica. While it is mandatory, this is not enforced -- at least not in the Treasure Beach area. The main reason students do not attend school is economic. While the primary school is free, parents must pay for books, uniforms, school supplies, and lunches. Also, there are no school busses, so parents must arrange and pay for transportation. However, even in the face of poverty, more parents are learning how to prioritize; the majority now realize how essential it is for their children to attend school on a regular basis.

Grades seven through 12 are high school. High school is not mandatory, and students do not automatically progress to high school. Sixth graders must take ("sit for") the GSAT (Grade Six Achievement Test); this is a rigorous, two-day exam containing five different subjects. A percentge of students do not sit for the GSAT because they believe they will do quite poorly on it.

To go to seventh grade (from primary school to high school), the students have to score well on their GSATS. And, depending upon their scores, they are told which high school they can attend. (There are several which serve the Treasure Beach area; these are in Newell, Junction, Black River, Santa Cruz, and Malvern. The two in Malvern -- Hampton and Munro -- are private; the others are public.) In other words, where the students go is determined by scores, not geographic proximity. If a student gets into either Hampton or Munro and cannot afford the tuition, then he or she can attend a public high school. In any case, there are steep costs associated with either the public or private high schools; these include school fees (tuition), transportation, books and school supplies, uniforms, and lunches. The public school costs range from about $1,250 to $1,500 (U.S.) per year, while those for the private schools are nearly $3,000 (U.S.) per year.

These costs -- exceedingly expensive by Jamaican standards -- are why I established Treasure Beach Foundation.

I was amazed when I found out that some children don't go to school at all. I met young adults who could not read or do most arithmetic.

How can farmers apply fertilizer safely, or drive their produce to market safely, if they can not read? How can fishermen evaluate a loan for a boat or make sure the price of fish covers the cost of gas if they never learn math?

One minor correction to Karen's post:
Munro College is in the Potsdam District (commonly called Munro), not Malvern. The two are about 5 miles apart. A small distinction, but important to those who live there.

And a follow up to Educated in Connecticut's point: Its certainly not the case that the farmers/fishermen are not intelligent (though I know this is not what was implied). Ever play dominoes with some of them? The amount and speed of counting and calculating they do makes my head spin.

Thanks for the geographical correction, Eric.

You will find more adults who cannot read than who cannot do math. And, though they may not be able to do "formal" math, they certainly can do "practical" math. I have yet to meet a lady in the market who could not multiply and add faster than I could (and I'm fast). Likewise, fishermen calculate the value of their catch in their heads fater that someone with a calculator.

When I came to Jamaica 20+ years ago, I quickly learned the difference between illiteracy and intelligence.

Literacy, however, is becoming increasingly more important as fishing and farming become more difficult.

Thank you for the explanation. WOW Karen this really hits home why the scholarship program is so important. The annual costs you quoted, does that cover tuition only or does it include the books etc? I bet some of the children won't sit for the GSAT not only because they think they might not do well, but probably know it would be an impossibility financially to attend High School even if they did do well...very sad. Big Up to all the Children that keep motivated to do well even when they aren't sure what the future holds. My father could not read or write but he was an amazing man, the best man I've ever know, very intelligent, just from a very poor family that had to have the children work in the fields instead of going to school, just to get by. I understand his situation more and more each trip I take to Jamaica where I see many families are in the same situation, and you just love each other and do the best you can and hope the next generation has it a little better than you, that was my father’s goal and before he died he accomplish that with his children and he was very proud.

I have a few more questions. Can you tell me about Munro College? What kind of college is it? What does it specialize in? Do they have a computer lab? Do all the High Schools you mentioned have computer labs? For High School, when are the fees do, and are the amounts split up through out the school year?

The annual costs I quoted are fairly all-inclusive -- meaning they cover tuition, books, school supplies, uniforms, transportation, and lunches. (If a student boards at either Hampton or Munro, there are additional costs; these are not part of the costs I’ve mentioned.)

There is a three-term (semester) system in Jamaica, and tuition is due prior to the start of each term; the fees are not exactly 1/3 per term because they are based upon the number of weeks in each term, and each term has a slightly different number of weeks.

Munro College is not actually a college, though the name (to us) is misleading; it is an all-boys high school. Munro has produced more Rhodes Scholars than any other school in the Caribbean. Likewise, Hampton School is an all-girls high school; both Munro and Hampton are among the most lauded high schools in Jamaica. More info can be obtained from their Web site, www.munrohampton.com.

All the high schools in the area have computer labs, not just Munro and Hampton.

Karen where do you get your information . What two-year-old do you know of that attends basic school, and who told you it was not inforced. I was born and bred in Treasure Beach. It was manditory that I go to school every day, and then moved on to Sandy Bank Primay. I even attended Lessons every evening, until I passed my (common entrance, now GSAT) and moved on to Hampton High. Please get your stories straight. Most of the people that cannot read or write, is probably the older people, people in the 80's and 90's. I take an offence when I read such things on a website geared toward Jamaican living away from home, as a means of communication, or obtaining information about loved ones. I have been meaning to address this before, but it seems this website is over-run by foreigners, no offence to a few choice people, you know who you are. The people responsible for the great change, positive change, not negitive things. Karen you ment well, but please research your facts first.

Thank you.
Trina B

Trina, I apologize for not having the facts 100% correct. Please note that in my original posting I said: "This may not be entirely accurate, so I invite someone else to add to what I'm saying -- or correct me where I may have made an error." It is silly to get into an argument with you, as it is clear that we are both highly interested in the same thing -- a good education for all the young people. And, it is obvious that you are quite bright and come from a family that emphasizes the value of an excellent education. All students (not just in Jamaica) do not necessarily have such backgrounds or advantages.

By the way, I do know of two-year-olds (though nearly three years old) who have been allowed to attend the basic school. And, as anyone can tell you, there are far too many young people in Treasure Beach who do not attend school on a regular basis, though I admit those numbers are diminishing. (If there is a truant officer -- or similar, I am not aware of this; and, again, I invite you to fill us in on exactly how enforcement works in the Treasure Beach area.) There are also many young people in the Treasure Beach area who have dropped out of school and whose reading abilities are close to the beginner level. But, yes, most of the people who cannot read are probably 50 or older.

I was speaking of three young men I personally met and talked with, who could not read, and did not go to school when they were younger. They were all between the ages of 20 and 40.

Maybe they were supposed to go to school, but did not.

Karen:

Thanks again for your (and all at the TB Foundation) scholarship efforts for the TB and surrounding areas. Its very commendable.

And I wouldn't worry about apologizing; you weren't the one who was rude. You clearly asked for any corrections to the information you posted and you were the one who used proper Net etiquette. Thanks for raising the level of dialogue in this Forum.

It shouldn't be taken for granted that all 18-35
year olds in Jamaica can read and write, even on the most basic levels. I've met many intelligent
Jamaicans in this age group who were surprisingly illiterate. Some, if they have transport, try to improve their situation, through night schools. But given the cost of transport and study after trying to make money during the day, the effort often fails unless the student is incredibly motivated. Are there opportunities like night
school in TB already -- or ones that could
also be funded?

Thanks Karen, I had no idea about Munro and Hampton being all boy and/or all girl schools. Your info is very informative and helps me get a better understanding of the basic system and how it works. Hopefully I can do more to help in the future. Keep up the great work! If you're around I would love to meet you in person and have a chat as I have tons more questions, I'll be around Nov 20-Dec 2 working on my community projects. PS: I love St. Elizabeth and all her children.

Eric, Please dont encourage, or instigate an argument. I am currently living in USA, where I have ment so many Americans that cannot read, or their reading level is that of a seven or eight year-old, not just in Jamaica. Yes I was fortunate to be from a family that provided for me, but not because you people or helping does not give you the right to place Jamaica, Treasure Beach mainly in such low esteem. Please feel free to help and have a debate about it, but do it in a more respected manner. The education level of most Jamaican high schooler is equal, or exceeds the level of most college student in their junior or senior year in America I know because I attended college here in the US as well. I mean where do you live when you are here in the US Eric? I recently paid a visit to my local walmart and dropped a few things in the boxes that provide for less fortunate kids here in America, they beg for Christmas stockings, school supplies, food, clothes, etc, much less in Jamaica. Come on guys it is bad, but it is not the worst, be considerate for the people, encourage, but dont distroy the place. My friends here visit this website every day and they have surly become discourage to visit where I am from.

Special thanks and appreciation to the people in charge of the scholarships that was awarded to these children. Every country needs that. My husband's company just started one here for children who's grade level is C or lower, because they are less likly to attend college or obtain a scholarship. Please advice on how we can start something like this in Treasure Beach.
Thanks
Trina B

I wish I could meet you, but I won't be in Treasure Beach when you are -- at least not this year. Maybe in 2007 ...

Tell us about your community projects, please.

I wish I could compare the school system in Jamaica and then USA. High school in Ja. is of higher standard than the USA. I can attest to this, my road of higher learing start from Newell Secondary and STETHS.
I attended engineering school in the USA, I can tell you all, my second year in college was equvalent to my senior year at STETHS. The high school drop out rate in the USA is way higher than Ja. on a percentage level....Did I mention that public high school in the USA is free, if only our kids have this great opportunity.
Lets stop talk and take action, what can we do to help the kids in our community TB< Newell etc.

I, too, attended Hampton; and I received an excellent education. One thing I learned, Trina, was to be gracious to all the people who taught me and provided help to me. My interpretation of what I have been reading on this website is different from yours. You may not have meant to be less than polite to Karen and the others who are going out of their way to provide assistance in Treasure Beach, but your comments sound so angry. Why would Karen want to tell you how to start a scholarship programme when you have essentially insulted her? On behalf of Hampton, I apologise for Trina’s remarks.

Trina B,I agree with you,the same people that say they are trying to help are the sameone's that are putting us down,yes our community needs all the help we can give, but not with a price of downgrading the one's that cant read,U.S have more people cant read than our beautiful country,if you cant help without putting the people down please dont help, because we know it would be for a show, like a lot of other things that people clame to be helping with some of wich is for there own gain,dont think for one moment we dont know what's going on,even with this new project when it's finish we will see where all the money is going,we are going to here who put up money for this and for that, and they all have to get it back because it was a loan,i am a born Treasure Beach girl, and dont like what's going on,all of a sudden every one have intrest in our community to me it's not about the people it's about what they can put in there pocket.i am sorry for my people because they have know say about any thing that go on there.the people with the money have all the say, we need to come out of hiding and take our beautiful Treasure Beach back.

Two year olds do go to school, my son turned two in June and was in school that same September. He now goes to Cornwall College in Mantego Bay.

I implore you all to be more positive about this whole matter.To be successful we have to take the good from the bad.Don't forget that Karen and the other people involved in this project do not know much about our school system.They are mainly trying to get a better understanding of what exactly goes on in our country so they are better able to help us. Think positive and if you don't have something good to say please don't.Anger will not get us anywhere.

Well said observer, these are the reasons why some people are skeptical about helping because our people are quick to be negative and point fingers, It's one thing pointing fingers but it's another pointing in the wrong direction ,When someone like Karen took the iniative to help out in such a good and positive way she should be Applauded instead of been Ridiculed, Same goes for Rebecca, Eric and all the others who apply themselves and time to the betterment of our little community they seem to get more flack than praise, for the average person this would be discouraging but thank god for them they do what they are doing from the heart and nothing else, Keep doing what you are doing guys some people do appreciate you.

Observer, thank you for helping put this in the proper perspective. Let's try to remember that those who help others are usually doing it out of compassion, and not to get something for themselves. I have found this to be the case with the TB Foundation. Before donating, I contacted Karen to ask how much of my donation would go to the scholarships, and how much would go to adminstrative costs. Her reply was that nearly every cent goes to the scholarships, and she spends her own money as well. It's true that there are people who try to take advantage of others through organizations that claim to help children, but this is not one of them. The motivation is purely to help others without regard to national boundaries. Many Americans might question why this foundation has focused on helping Jamaicans when there are so many needy people in our own country (and yes, as a teacher I can attest to the alarming number of students who go through the US public education system and come to my college lacking basic skills.) I think part of the answer is that in the US, most kids already have the opportunity to learn, but many cannot or chose not to take full advantage of it. The TB Foundation aims to give scholarships to kids who don't have the same opportunities as US kids. Please don't think that outsiders are putting anyone down. Sometimes it may seem that way, but remember that people who didn't grow up there aren't as aware of the culture, and may sometimes say and do things that seem insensitive or even insulting. That is not the intention. Please help to gently educate those of us so this type of misunderstanding does not get in the way of the ultimate goal, which is to help educate the children of your wonderful community. We may not be from TB, but we are all God's children. Peace.

Believe it or not there truely are people that visit Treasure Beach that simply want to help with no other motive other than love. No put down, no degrading of either country....just love for each other. To hear such negativity makes me so sad and deflated. This thread started out with the best of intentions to find a way to better serve the community, how could it be turned around so quickly? NO ill will was EVER intended! No matter what anyone has to say I know in my heart I have always given more than I've taken, and will continue to help the community in anyway possible with a positive attitude and a caring heart, and even though I can be deflated and saddened I won't be stopped, because I have a deep love for you. Peace and Love, Lynnette

Well said Peggy Ankey--Lynnette/Sweetlips---Observer---and Treasure Beach Girl.I myself think harsh remarks were written and if only we had more folks like Karen along with others like her then our TB youths would be much better off.
God Bless everyone that's helping.

IT SOUNDS TO ME "TRINA B" AND "THE TRUTH" IS THE SAME PERSON JUST TRYING TO DEFEND THYSELF.

IF YOU ARE NOT THE SAME THEN YOU BOTH SHOULD REALLY STOP AND THINK HOW MUCH YOU MAY BE HURTING THE YOUNG KIDS IN TREASURE BEACH IF THE PROGRAM THAT IS NOW IN FORCE DECIDE TO JUST GO AWAY.

LIVING IN THE STATES AND TALKING ABOUT WHAT AND WHERE YOU WENT TO SCHOOL/COLLEGE DO NOT SHOW ME HOW WELL YOU ARE USING YOUR EDUCATION.I ONLY SEE BRAGGING AND BOASTING AS THEY WOULD SAY IN JAMAICA. HELP IS WHAT IS NEEDED AND IT IS THERE SO JOIN THE GANG AND DO SOME GOOD.
IF YOU CANNOT GIVE SOME POSITIVE VIBE THEN I WOULD JUST SAY TO YOU--- CHILL-OUT----- AND LET THE GOOD PEOPLE CARRY ON .THEY DO NOT EVEN HAVE TO DO THIS. THERE IS NOTHING IN IT FOR THEM MORE THAN TO HELP THE YOUTHS IN TREASURE BEACH.HOW THANKFUL WE SHOULD ALL BE HAVING PEOPLE LIKE THESE THAT DO CARE.YOU CAN TELL I AM ANGRY WRITING IN THIS FASHION.

Trina B and that other person is not one and the same. Please note the pronunciatons, the choice of words and the spellings.
Listen. You guys making it seems like I am putting Karen down. I am not.Mainly what I am trying to do is to show you guys that you can help, but please be considerate of your discription of the people and the place. The same people that you are seeking help from, do not help due to your discriptions, they help because they are from there or they have visited. They know the runnings, so exaggerations is not necessary. How am I hurting the young kids? I never said to stop. I encourage Karen and the other to continue. I even offered to help. As a matter-of-fact I few years ago, an organization call the professional Jamaican association, sponsored schools from different areas with providing schools supplies and uniforms,so how am I discouraging? All I asked is be more considerate, these are adults, who will feel less of a person than they are if you take their pride.(I attended a class here, when the hurricane came through last year, which teaches us how to help, but still allow people to mentain their sense of pride, if you loose your pride, and your self, all the education or help, will be wasted, you need pride,knowledge and encourgement to carry on. You are all preceiving this wrongly. All I am saying is for a third world country we are doing extremely well. Lousiana was just wiped out. I had to open my home to a family, with 2 children, that I have never met in my life, but I never speak badly about them. I never let them see how bad things really are for them. I encourage the mother, and provide for the children, without making them feel that they are less fortunate than my own child. There are ways to help without let anyone know that they are being help. If you keep ranting and raving about it, people will think that you are doing this for self gratification, like that other person said. "this is not what I am saying" I am strickly quoting. I am a 1st year med student, and a Administrative Registerd Nurse(who obtained a full scholarship to Duke University, thanks to funds from others, and a good head start from Hampton) Here. I am in charge of 35 Nurses and nurse tech who looks to me for orders, advice and encourgement. They read this every day, then they look to me and asked Nurse..**how are you helping so many when your country is the pits. That is degrading to me."another question was, Can your mom read?" come on get my point...I am not trying to upset anyone. Karen I am not sure as to when I will be back in my area. My schedule is very hectic at this point, but some of my colleagues here are putting together a fund raiser, and other funds, so I will keep in touch.

Thanks

Trina B

This is geared toward "also a hampton grad" I am not down sizing what Karen is doing. I think of all the people that read this webpage, she is the only one that truly understand my point. I am very grateful for what I have achieved, and all of that is strictly through the grace of god my Aunts, friends and family, that I was able to reach my level of education. I was grateful then, and I am even more grateful now, because now I can help others.I hope you are also playing your part, and not sitting by, with your first grade education and not doing your part, because you will not have allowed yourself room to comment. Read carefully, and understand clearly. Nothing I have said was ment in the manner in which you and other are preceiving it.
Thanks for allowing me to explain myself.

Trina B

Home girl. Why are you so upset. No one is bragging and boasting. And yes I have helped, and I will continue to help. My point of mentioning where I went to school, is to show that due to my level of education that I recieved in Jamaica I was able to attend college on a full scholorship to Duke Universtiy where I obtained my degree in Nursing. I was trying to point out that an education in Jamaica is worth more than anyone can even imagine.Due to that first start I am able to better myself and my family. It was not to bragg or boast, because that will never get me any further in life than I am now, and I do plan on going further. If you read carefully you will see that I have helped, and I am seeking ways to help even more. Also hampton grad. You encourageing Karen to not tell me how I can help was very elementary and juvenile. How is that helping? I dont have to show how I help or say how, but believe me I have and I will continue to do so, and hey you need to keep your angry in check, before you get out of hand. Simple things such as this should never anger anyone.

Thanks
Trina B

Trina B,
You need to take a chill pill. According to you this website is flooded with "foreigners," these people are trying to help. I don't see why you should be so angry, is it because you are not from Treasure Beach and have witnessed and experienced the people of treasures beach like everyone else. Be humble they don't have to help us. You should not have to ask how to start a scholarship. If you really wanted to you would have researched it a LONG time ago. Just remember no one have to help these kids it's been done out of the goodness of their hearts.

I think it's time to close this discussion because as Jamaicans would say 'The higher the monkey climb, the more he expose his rear end'. All that 'gibberish' coming from one particular individual does not make sense. Keep up the good work Karen!! One Love.

Trina B, I would be exceedingly grateful for any assistance you could provide. If you wish to send a donation in any amount to Treasure Beach Foundation for the Scholarship Fund, it would be most appreciated. If you would prefer to assist in another way, there are many fine organizations listed under Community Groups on TreasureBeach.net—and any of them would be grateful for your help. In terms of starting and administering your own scholarship program, that is most certainly a possibility; however, it is a very time-consuming thing to handle, and it sounds as if you already have your hands quite full with all your professional responsibilities.

Please understand that I am in no way trying to insult or be insensitive to the feelings of people in Treasure Beach. Instead, I want to help provide opportunities to people whose needs are important—but whose voices are often unheard.

Hi Trina B
We could keep going on and on but what's the point.You said your friends that visit this web site daily has become discouraged to visit where you are from. Tell them to take a trip and judge for themselves maybe they will be more humble and understanding and will then draw their own conclusions as to exactly the point we are trying to get across.
When we talk about anger I think we all should go back and read our messages again.Yes I did say I was angry after reading your messages for 7/16 and 7/19.
Jamaica is not the "PITTS" and I do hope some of these students you talk about their parents can read and write.It's good to see you have made something of your life with the help of others so please Encourage not Discourage.
I hope when they asked if your mom can read you looked them straight in the face and said "Of course just like your moms can".
One more thing many of the people posting messages on this web site is not even from Treasur Beach proper. I was born right on the sand of French Beach.

Trina, are you making reference to my "first grade education" by suggesting I only completed grade one, or are you suggesting I received a first-rate education at Hampton (which I did)? I graduated with honours after completing the sixth form. Perhaps the perception difficulties you believe virtually everyone seems to have with what you say has to do with the fact you do not express yourself too clearly. Trust me, I am doing my part, but I refuse to brag and boast about how I choose to help. Several of the other contributors to this forum are spot on with their comments about your demeanour. While "chill pill" is not an expression I commonly use, I believe Treasuregirl in NYC has made a useful recommendation. Calm down. Be thankful for all the people who are helping in Treasure Beach, no matter from where they come. Do not assume they have ulterior motives; rather, assume they are caring and upstanding persons. In addition, to answer an earlier question, there is no formal enforsement of school attendance in Treasure Beach; that is left to the families, even though attendance is most certainly encouraged by the schools.

I cannot stress enough the value of an Education it is priceless. Any efforts that are made in the direction of eradicating illiteracy should be welcome.

There are many communities in Jamaica (the world on a whole) that are haunted by the illteracy plauge, and if we in Treasure Beach can set precedence, then why should we.

Perhaps no patience for patients?

As for Educated in Connecticut, why are you so surprised that there are people in the Treasure Beach area who cannot read/write? I would invite you to take a brief look at the education system in the USA, the richest country in the WORLD, since you are comparing countries....(1) kids graduating from high school who cannot complete an application form.....(2) free (public education), yet children are often not attending classes, but are hanging out at the corner. Sir/Madam, there are poor, uneducated people everywhere in this world...so let's be good to others without the mud slinging, it's not worth it. Let us not be like the cow that gives a bucket of milk but steps into it. As one writer said, "The poor we will always have among us".

I can tell after reading the debate on this ongoing saga that Karen is a real lady.
She carries herself in the most professional manner even after being attacked by some on this web site.
If only there were a handfull more like her along with her organization to help not only the youths of Treasure Beach but youths in other surrounding areas.
Keep up the good work Karen.Glad to see you had some die-hard fans sticking up for you.

Pardon me if I am wrong, but I have always felt you were bias. Why would you not publish an article because it showed the negative side of the US, and so readily publish ones that showed the negative side of Treasure Beach? Again, in the US there are many uneducated people, just like Treasure Beach. Children are graduating every year from High School and cannot fill out an application form. Although high school education is free, some children are still not utlizing the opportunities offered them; they rather hang out at the corner.

TB Hit, please let us know what article you are referring to as we have not received any message containing an article. Please try and send it again, as maybe it did not go through.