Hummingbirds do not usually perch on ones fingers.

See video: http://rocklandsbirdsanctuary.com/

Can trust develop between birds and humans? By extension: mistrust?

Dogs? cats? Not sure about earthworms Spooky.

BTW Dude, better start listening to the daughters and not Fido. I know, between boys and Ipods, no time for dear dad. Fido must be amused.

A visit to Ms Salmons Sanctuary should be a prerequisite to a birdshooters permit. As should a day at the morgue be for any gun license. All a unnu lucky I'm not Dictator in Charge ;)

Reminds me of a visit from a friend just fresh from beating up some people...true true. Drunk and trained by the best of the old boys. He boasted of his abilty to kill with one blow of his right hand. He sobered when asked which hand he used to restore life.

We visited Rockland's bird sanctuary 30 years ago and the caretaker gave us a tube of sugar water, whistled, and hummingbirds flew in from every direction waiting for an opening to land on our fingers and get a sip. The caretaker loved those birds...who wouldn't.

we eat the feathered creatures turey. To do that we have to snuff them out, whether by plucking, shooting, or otherwise. On the other hand, consuming other humans is not on the menu. Your comparison between the morgue and bagging a few fowls is off base.

As for Fido, a pet in our neck of the woods, there may be a few cultures in the Far East that will tell you that they don't mind seeing him in the buffet. I personally think bird shooting is tame in comparison.

Have you ever gone fishing and try to take the hook out of a stubborn fish mouth? Not a pleasant experience for the fish turey but a necessity for someone who enjoys salty fare. What about the fisherman who has to give a sharp toothed congry eel a few whack of his "monkle" (forgive the spelling) to prevent a deadly bite? I hope the animal rights folks don't take offense to that too.

Sportsman, eating dead animals is the most efficient means of getting sufficient quality protein for growth. Our ancestors thrived on it. Hunting was the only way to get nutrition.

I am fortunate to be able to access quality nutrition from the vegetable world and have for the last 40 years. I was never comfortable with the euphemisms about the sources of meat. The idea of a non meat diet was mocked and thought to make one weak and unmanly. I heave cement bags and work in the rain and sun, my plumbing and reasoning are intact at 62.

Eat whatever your cells tell you. If it's raw blood or oats porridge, your body knows what it requires.

Our tastes however, have been influenced by the foods we were given from early. Mass media has stepped in to further influence us to the advantage of business, not health.

To kill for fun is strange to me, I am likewise mocked as unmanly and not sporting by some. Suh it guh.

The morgue for a gun license and Rocklands for birdshooting license (not cannibals permit). No more bizarre than killing as entertainment.

As a meat eater, I believe I might become a vegetarian if I had to watch the animal being killed. Because I buy meat nicely wrapped from a supermarket, I can avoid thinking that it came from an animal someone killed. I realize this is somewhat hypocritical. At the same time, I believe killing for sport is not a real sport because it is unfair that both sides do not have the same advantage. I find most people who kill for sport to be trying to prove something and make themselves feel more successful.

I don't tell anyone what to eat. I personally did not eat red meat for almost thirty years until I rediscovered the joy of a charred piece, and I only now do so sparingly. Anyone who wants to exist solely on vegetation is free to do so. Stop trying to marginalize those of us who insist otherwise. Thank providence our ancestors didn't second guess throwing their rocks before inventing the sling and the spear, or the bow-and-arrow, otherwise many of us would not be here on our soap box.

Turey why is killing for fun so strange to you? Don't you think prehistoric man exulted in the kill, realizing that not only was he assured of supper but that, somewhere in the subconscious, he received reassurance that he could conquer the elements and thus survive? It is the same thrill I get when I feel a tug on my fishing line even if I'm only engaged in catch and release, and not necessarily looking for a meal. The thrill of the kill is innate in us for a million reasons. I see nothing strange in that.

Thanks for hanging in on this subject Sportsman.

I don't see any fighting or marginalising based on diet or habits. Only different points of view stating their feelings and facts.

Hunting and fishing are no longer necessary sources of nutrition, neither is factory farming of mammals. Humans can thrive on a proper diet from the vegetable world saving water and energy and allowing more direct consumption of crops from the earth thus using less land to feed humans. The ratio is somewhere between 10-20 people can be fed with the same energy it takes to feed one meat eater. Have not heard this from those that are guiding Jamaica Sustainability 2030. Too controversial eh.

Be the thrill of bird shooting atavistic or pathological, facing real game face to face is where the thrill lies. It's the risk that sharpens the hunt. Facing a tiger shark or mountain lion when hunting in his domain is when the adrenalin pumps and sport starts.

Seems to me you trend towards the extreme in trying to explain your point of view turey. I have put forth my low keyed, and perhaps less rewarding, point of satisfaction in my quest for thrill. I'm at that middle ground which suits me fine. Mountain lions don't inhabit my part of the world so they need not fear me. I wouldn't mind a tiger shark testing me though! A wild turkey and a few quails, or perhaps a hogfish at the tip of my spear will suffice.

As long as it works for you, stick with your diet. Just keep in mind that nutritionists change their fickle minds almost every day. Remember a short time ago when egg whites was the choice of the inteligencia? Well now we are being told about the unbelievable nutritional value of this newly discovered thing called "egg". I could refer you to a book "Eat Right 4 Your Type" by Dr Peter J. D'Adamo (the "4" refers to our blood types) but, knowing you, you would then counter that with a book of your own, and then I would....

After all is said and done, I believe in moderation. I would never hunt anything that is endangered. I also draw the line when it comes to others such as Bambi. But my consternation continues with the arbitrary downing of those who don't toe the line of so-called civilization and modernity.

Against sport hunting: No one kills just for sport; it is part of our psyche to hunt. Everything that is killed is eaten. There is no difference between what is raised and slaughtered for meat and what is hunted, except what is hunted stands a better chance of escaping than what is raised. How many people do you know who kill for sport, much more to know that "most people who kill for sport to be trying to prove something and make themselves feel more successful". {edited by TBNet}
turey: if you are a vegetarian because of an aversion to killing, then you should not try to rid your environment of mosquitoes, roaches, white flies, rats and other pests. Nobody is killing for entertainment: they kill because it provides a connection to our basic instincts to hunt and at the same time provide a very tasty morsel for our palate. There is nothing more satisfying than growing what we eat or catching fish or shooting birds....buying packaged meat cannot compare with that! Those who do not have the stomach for that should be condemned to starve, because it does not matter how you look at it, a life has to be sacrificed for humans to eat...it is either plant or animal!!

Right Sportsman, we only have wild hogs to challenge on land. I would not encourage everyone to spearfish. Fish scarce anyway.

Quality protein, carbs free of simple sugars and good fats/oils. That's the basic message of nutritionists. How to get them and the quantities needed is the trick.

Civilsation and modernity? Never knew we achieved civilisation! Modernity seems industry driven. Right to be wary of them as real.

My crew tells me that when a shark threatens; "Jus juck him in the gills". I keep quite until he slithers away.

Where do you draw the line? Does lettuce and yam have feelings too? Should we consider that when we kill the lettuce to eat? Is there a humane way to kill lettuce??

You tell me Spooky one.

Ever hear a lettuce scream in fear and pain?

Ever visit a slaughter house?

Sorry Sportsman, sometimes extremes make the picture clearer.

And yes, if I camped on Baffin Island, I'd hunt and eat same as the Inuit do. Unless I could carry enough brown rice and lentils for the time. And olive oil, dried veg, miso....see, may as well nyam local.

Guess the line is drawn by common sense and respect for all our relations Dude. The ancient Golden Rule. The others including non humans.

Sheesh Spooky, Fido could have told you that

turey: I did not post the previous post attributed to me. Not withstanding that, with all due respect turey, are you for real?
TBNet: can you explain how someone can use my name with my EMail address?? My relatives and friends of TB are not so devious and none of them know my Email address, so how come this mischief can continue? I know what is happening and it had better stop or someone will pay the price.


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Spooky Dude, you have used your address on this board before next to where your enter your username. In order to copy the email address, all one needs to do is right click and select Copy.

I believe this is one of the first ones you did this with.
http://webtonic.info/discus/messages/8121/18014.html?1317230613#POST72678

Does this clear up the matter?

All the postings after the one on the 13th were not done by me. The one before this one thanking TBNet for explaining what is happening was done by me.

I was talking to Spooky Duppy?

Yes sir turey, someone is trying to make mischief.