What is progress and its price?

Treasure Beach Forum: TB Runnin's: What is progress and its price?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By stepup on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 - 04:33 pm: Edit Post

As a resident of Treasure Beach I found it bordering on disrespectful that no plans had been shown or discussed with this community in general before the seaplane landed in the Great Pond February 28th. Despite the many owners of said pond objecting to the event, the plane landed regardless. This same lack of respect and consideration was also true of the Sports Park, and it was only a few persevering people, who upon discovering inadvertently where the plans were kept, began to object to the size of the proposed Sports Park and prompted the community to re-think the size and what impact something that large would have on such a small residential area. Only then did the size reduce. It would indeed have been a huge error to have constructed what was first on the drawing board. So thanks to a diligent few, it is now more to scale for its residents and community ... although not anywhere as small as to what I would willingly agree to. In fact, I amongst others, are curious to know how it will be funded monthly to cover the expenses of keeping it well maintained. I do hope there is no intention to hold music events at the Sports Park, which would undoubtedly further disrupt the quiet of the close residents.

It was disappointing that the speech Jason Henzell made to the Treasure Beach community was posted on this Forum. I was looking forward to absorbing the content of what Mr. Henzell had to say, as it did start with (and I quote) "We have come here tonight to discuss the historical landing of a Float Plane in Treasure Beach, and its future operation", but no discussion took place on the "future operation" aspect of it, and it was full of so many "I did that" and "I did this" that I stopped reading as realized I was being sucked into a PR vortex. There is no need to "big up" oneself if in fact one works within a community and is respected by most. I am wary, like many, of those that have to "big up" themselves.

May I bring up at this point that to date NO disclosure of the seaplane business plan has come forth.

One "hears" it will only be an occasional landing, then one "hears" it is going to be landing several times a day. We know only too well about progress in this country. When something is successful people get greedy and tend to over-develop the business ... first it might be one seaplane once a day, then three times a day, then five seaplanes, then jet-skies and other various types of loud motorized land and watercraft. Where does it stop before the balance is tipped and we lose the precious resource of peace and quiet?

The pilot of the seaplane stood up and talked at the meeting, stating that in Canada there are seaplanes all over the place. What he failed to say was that the lakes in Canada are large and can easily accommodate seaplanes without disturbing anyone. Plus, there are usually no roads where the seaplanes go, meaning little or no other option is available to get to those areas of wilderness. Canada has very strict environmental protection laws and it is highly doubtful that seaplanes could land anywhere and at will.. And should there be an oil, gas spill or god forbid, an accident, in Canada they have the resources to aid immediately. We do not. If we were to have any kind of gas or oil leak from a plane (or jetskis for that matter) in this tiny little pond, that would be the end of the pond for decades to come. These ponds, which are already so few, are part of a fragile and unique eco system that both visitors to this area and most residents appreciate. Why would we risk the decimation of our pond just so a few people can get to Treasure Beach quickly? That is not the point of coming here [or living here] from what I can surmise. Further, a seaplane business will not create jobs, as seaplanes carry very few passengers per trip and luggage allowance is minimal. Visitors and Jamaicans coming to spend a week or two (who do support this community in so many ways) would most likely have more luggage than a seaplane could handle. The only people that I see would benefit making money off the venture would be the investors, and the pilots. Not the community per se.

There is not one person I know who has come and stayed in this area who has not commented on why it is they love it, and why it is they will return. And return they do .. year after year... because it is quiet and peaceful, and they can walk the roads, the pathways, the beaches, and feel a part of this community. They spend quality time with residents, they love memories such as taking pictures of the lady selling vegetables on the donkey (and she gawn already), they glee when they come across goats in the middle of the road, and in many cases they form friendships with us locals. A strong connection is experienced with Jamaicans and their way of life in a small "safe" community. They are not accosted like in most other parts of the island - yet - however signs are here with the persistent wooden bird and trinket sellers and a few others, who by the way are not from here, but are already infiltrating. Primarily, Treasure Beach is an escape from the concrete jungles that the visitors often come from. And when people return to a place over and over, renting guest houses, villas and hotel rooms, or staying with newly made friends, THAT is the testimony of a place in balance with what it authentically offers. People who work in the industry would be able to keep their jobs on a fulltime basis, and therefore better their own lives with a steady income. This "uniqueness" is the foundation of a long term investment - and is not to be scoffed at. (If one was to estimate the number of people who work full-time at the houses and villas, it would be around 230 people, not counting the many others whose incomes are earned from visitors .. such as boat captains, drivers, farmers, shop keepers etc.

Treasure Beach is unique compared to any other part of Jamaica from what I can see, so why is it that we ourselves cannot recognize what we have, and protect it like the treasure it is? Our beaches are not white sand like the north coast, nor is our sea clear and blue. That is not what people come here for. They come for a chance to experience something they have never known, or perhaps something they have lost touch with. A community. And without the ponds, without the birds, without the quiet, without the open spaces of green, without the gentle people, the authenticity that is here stands the chance of being lost forever and more than likely we will quickly become like everywhere else .. a noisy concreted rat race. Chances are that without the open land on which the ponds sit, there would already be housing schemes. Just look around at which huge houses being constructed all over this Parish, and to which the water supply is greatly lacking. (Can we rectify this problem soon?)

I believe people should be allowed to voice their opinions (from which would evolve valuable points) to bring about the balance needed, without fear of losing their income and jobs. Being fearful of talking is not the way to maintain a healthy and progressive community. It enevitably builds resentment and dissparitiveness between people. A community and its individuals have the right to absorb and mull over any plans that someone comes up with, that in essence will affect any and every one in the community. How better to "grow" a community than by the community themselves - young and old?

In Jamaica we are basically distrustful of ideas and plans as for so many years we have been promised so much and got so little from the politicos. Isn't it best therefore to be "transparent" with plans and deter speculation that quickly builds up resentment, becomes negative, is an opportunity for rumours to fly rampant, and eventually becomes a time waster as one then has to backtrack, undo rumours, make good with those that are negative; using energy that could be generating more positive stuff or simply enjoying oneself. Time has proven that the more input a project or an idea has, the better the product in the end.

Jason Henzell had an opportunity on March 2nd to apologize to not only the landowners of the pond, (where it seems he had no legal right to encourage the landing of the seaplane, as it is privately owned and had been told that no permission was given to land on it), but also to the residents of Treasure Beach. An apology acknowledging to all that he did something that he perhaps should not have done might have somewhat redeemed him in the eyes of many. We all make mistakes and we all need to learn when an apology is needed. What a good lesson that would have been for the youth too, who have so few people to look up to - to know that a man can say "sorry" and still be respected .. possibly even more respected for his "bigness" in doing so.

Please, can we go forward with respect and consideration for each and every one whose genuine interest is for here, in allowing Treasure Beach to bloom in an organic, open and honest way. Not to "develop" in any hurry, as once the balance has tipped the specialness is lost forever. And yes, we all want to make money .. but at what cost, when in the end we have to build higher walls, live behind burglar bars and barbed wire fences with attack dogs etc. - which is now happening at great speed.

We all have differences of opinions, and that is really okay. We are all different, have different life experiences and therefore different ways of looking at things .. but basically, as our livelihood is here, our friends are here, and our homes, hearts and lives are here, let us take the opportunity for this little community to be a leader in true democracy. And let's keep talking about how best to "pay it forward".

Now that would be progress, without paying a high price.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By cliffcrazy on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 - 07:14 pm: Edit Post

Well said !! Please dont let Treasure Beach turn into a Negril.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By jeanie and tom on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 - 09:49 pm: Edit Post

Amen


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Good Bad on Thursday, March 12, 2009 - 04:25 am: Edit Post

Well said, only sorry that it didn't have another chapter....


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By T.B on Thursday, March 12, 2009 - 06:33 am: Edit Post

Stepup you could\nt have state it any better ,its a pity you did\nt strike the iron while the fire was hot, you would\ve silence some of the critics and educate the misinformed.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By MikeyMike on Thursday, March 12, 2009 - 08:59 am: Edit Post

RIGHT ON !!!!!!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By TB Lover on Thursday, March 12, 2009 - 09:06 am: Edit Post

I totally agree with Stepup - let us build the community of TB in the right way i.e. open communication (public forums) before the fact, and honesty.
It's our community - we love it and must protect it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Villa Owner on Thursday, March 12, 2009 - 07:31 am: Edit Post

To Stepup: What you wrote was absolutely wonderful.

Everything new is not necessarily progress. It is not necessarily POSITIVE progress. I look at what we have done in the United States, and I see the horrible effects of much of our so-called progress. While much of what we have done here is wonderful, there is so much else that has served to poison the water and the air. There is no quick fix for what we—collectively—either have done or have not spoken out against. Some STILL do not believe in man-caused climate change. Too many are selfish and think they are ENTITLED to drive vehicles that are absolutely inefficient and release so much harm into our atmosphere. Others serve to poison our waters and then have the arrogance (or is it stupidity) to ask why there are less local fish to eat—or why it is now unsafe to eat our own fish. Personally, I believe it is the widespread feeling of ENTITLEMENT that has gotten our country into so much trouble.

Yes, people are entitled to make a living. People are entitled to try to improve themselves and the situations of their families. People are NOT entitled to do this by harming others. People are not entitled to do this by misleading others.

As someone who is vitally interested in Treasure Beach and its people, the seaplane venture is, to me, another sign of the disrespect shown to the residents and the various stakeholders in the community. In speaking to other villa owners, let me assure you that we make very little money; in fact, we often lose money. However, that is our choice. Keeping Treasure Beach wonderful is much more important. We hold jobs in the U.S. and Canada and England—jobs that enable us to have the "luxury" of operating a business in Treasure Beach.

Stepup was against the Sports Park in its original form. So was I. I was never, ever consulted or informed about what was happening by either Jason or BREDS. No villa owner was, no matter how often we asked. To me, this was disrespectful. Certainly, though we are not fulltime residents, we care deeply about Treasure Beach. Certainly, we are neither fools nor against progress. We want what is good for the community because what is good for the community is also good for us. I do not have the ability to look into the future, but I instinctively know the Sports Park will cause more harm than good. I want the youth of Treasure Beach to have a place for sports, but I see no reason for a project of this magnitude to be able to achieve this. Personally, I feel the residents have been duped about what the Sports Park will become. Everything comes with a price, and I fear the price for this will be very high. That price will not only be the fees that are charged for use by the residents; it will also be reflected in the increased traffic our roads cannot handle, in the increased garbage and waste for which we are unprepared, and for bringing many outsiders into the community—people who will come only for the entertainment value, not because they care about the uniqueness of the gem we all call Treasure Beach. I predict that loud and obnoxious events, many of them in the late hours, will HAVE to be held to be able to financially support this Park. We are asked to compare the Treasure Beach Sports Park to the one at Nain; this is ridiculous because Nain is not a residential community; in addition, Nain has some of the best roads in the entire area.

Our guests come for the peace and quiet, for the opportunity to make friends with the residents, for the natural and unspoiled beauty of both the environment and the people. Our guests come year after year, and their recommendations are what bring others.

There is quiet talk in the community about the negative impact of both the seaplanes and the Sports Park. Some find it curious that the Jake’s employees or others who derive a good portion of their income from Jake’s (the boat drivers, the taxi drivers, the fish sellers, and more) are not those who are speaking out against either the seaplane or the Sports Park. I do not find this curious. Quite honestly, if MY employees were to speak out in public against me, I would find it uncomfortable, and I might very well view them as being less than loyal. I might feel those people were at the top of my list to be replaced. After all, if they speak out against me, I would feel a diminishing of trust. So, the fact that “150” members of the “Jake’s family” appear to be in favor of the various “progressive” projects, that does not necessarily make them true supporters; that makes them people intelligent enough to understand from where their next paycheck is coming.

I am not against Jason. I am not against BREDS. I feel BREDS (with Jason as its head) has helped the community in many ways. I have contributed a decent amount of money to it in the past. In the future, I will withhold my contributions until I feel my opinions are both solicited and listened to.

I am against a feeling of entitlement of anyone who believes he or she has the right to make substantial changes in our community—changes which will have serious, permanent impact—without listening to all the stakeholders and truly caring about what they say.

I am requesting the respect of allowing my voice to be heard and for my honest feelings to be expressed. I do not think that is too much to ask.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Villa Owner #2 on Thursday, March 12, 2009 - 12:02 pm: Edit Post

Amen, amen, amen!!! Thak you for speaking out Villa Owner. You echo our sentiments. Perfectly.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By From A Concerned Visitor on Thursday, March 12, 2009 - 04:00 pm: Edit Post

We have questioned the Sports Park and have gotten two different schools of thought.

The housekeeper where we stay suggested the Sports Park would be a wonderful thing for the kids in the village. She was absolutely positive that no one local would have to pay one cent for using it. She even suggested people many people from the village would be able to find excellent employment there. We asked who would pay for it. She believes it would be paid for by "wealthy donors to BREDS from abroad". I presume she means people like us from the United States. (We are not wealthy, and even if we were we would not donate to fund something like this.) My impression is a lot of residents of Treasure Beach expect the Sports Park to be a windfall for them. They seem unfamilar with the adage, "There's no such thing as a free lunch".

Speaking to people in the community who are more educated (and I do not mean that as a slur) we received a different set of answers about the Sports Park. They are perhaps more sophisticated and can read in between the lines. They have shown us the lane where cars would be sent; it is a shambles, and it passes directly in front of residences. They have shown us the drainage problems on the land. They would like good things for Treasure Beach; a Sports Park is not on the list. What they want is: the canal to be finished and working properly. Better schools. Water, water, water. Trash collection on a more frequent basis. Recycling. Elimination of busrning of plastics and other harmful materials.

There IS no thing as a free lunch. Someone always pays.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Ashamed on Thursday, March 12, 2009 - 02:58 pm: Edit Post

I offer a hearty round of applause to all those who are no longer afraid to speak the truth on these pages. I have been aware of the situation for some time now but I have kept my mouth shut because I always considered Treasure Beach a small town where you were never supposed to speak ill of your neighbors. I am proud of all those who have added their sentiments not merely over the last week but since the sports park reared its ugly head. I am ashamed of myself for not having added my voice to theirs.

No matter what, I love Treasure Beach and its people.

From now on I will do what I can to support your efforts to fight injustice.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Villa Owner #3 on Thursday, March 12, 2009 - 09:01 pm: Edit Post

We agree with the thrust of the comments in this string and others. Enough IS enough. The community belongs to everyone. It is no one person's private property.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By turey on Friday, March 13, 2009 - 11:28 am: Edit Post

It can only be good that more of the community expresses their feelings and observations.

As it is unhealthy for an individual to stifle feelings, I have observed that it is so for a community too.

In most succesful collectives/tribes, local meetings were held regularly discussing issues with traditional etiquette. The lack of fast and local remedies in many communities either leaves issues buried or sees repressed energy released chaotically and sometimes violently. Neither is healthy.

In a way this forum is a tribal meeting ground. Born yah, live yah and love deh all represented. All with a chance to speak.

I and others look forward to the latest issues being discussed freely and the best outcome encouraged.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Got Booted on Friday, March 13, 2009 - 09:58 am: Edit Post

go tell them so you caan walk past the beach round Jakes hotel not even in the sea ....I DID NOT SAY JACK SPART.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By A Friend on Friday, March 13, 2009 - 12:44 pm: Edit Post

What is Got Booted saying? Is it illegal to walk in the water in front of Jake's? There really is no beach to speak of there but I recall when that little inlet ("beach") now filled with sand was sea and home to many beautiful fish. I thought all beaches were public.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By TB Fan on Friday, March 13, 2009 - 06:58 pm: Edit Post

Ah Turey, if only someone would HEAR the feelings of the community. How much louder is it necessary for us to be?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By turey on Friday, March 13, 2009 - 10:16 pm: Edit Post

I think many hear these feelings TB Fan.

I have been in situations where loudness was used out of frustration. Both sides of the issue got lost in noise.

To be willing to listen to voices other than those in ones head and to suspend decisions is often challenging. For those on all sides of the issues.

Maybe a good place to start would be to dispassionately make a list of these feelings, discard any that are based on false or distorted information and have as good look at those remaining.

Let me give it a try and I'll report back.

Not easy, that darn chatterer between my ears.........."Mememememe".

"Wewewewe" is just not in vogue.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By native on Friday, March 13, 2009 - 09:35 pm: Edit Post

Careful consideration should be given to any new development to make sure the preservation of the environment and the will of the majority of citizens is rspected.An independent study of the inpact of sea plane on the pond and surroundings and the greater community view could be helpful in reaching a unified resolve.

In 1976 three of us teenagers went to the beach in Fort Charles. We walked some distance southward along the beach.While passing a particular hotel a man rushed from the building and told us to move away as we were on private property.

We moved on without arguinig with him but we felt very offended as we felt strongly that the beaches belonged to the state and we had a right to enyoy them with others.

I welcome social and economic development that are timely and mindful of the populace and their thoughts and ideas.Our national and natural resources should be utilized well and as much as possible kept for the enjoyment of generations to come.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Citizen Cane on Friday, March 13, 2009 - 07:18 pm: Edit Post

Lack of transparency by the past administration and financial institutions in the last eight years in the U.S has, to a large extent, led the U.S, and consequently the rest of the world, into the deplorable financial situation that we are all currently suffering from.
Lack of transparency; not sharing,not taking the pulse of of all by open discussions, ignores the tenets of a Democratic society, where all have a voice.
This applies to a nation, as well as to a small community.
Take heed, a community that shares and is open is a harmonious community.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By mamacatb on Friday, March 13, 2009 - 08:43 pm: Edit Post

Having grown up in a small beach town on the Atlantic, I can speak from experience about the devastation of rapid commercial growth in a small community. When I grew up, there were only beach cottages and a few family run hotels. Today it is a huge city with no cottages and large chain hotels. The charm is gone. It has become what I imagine Negril has become or what Montego Bay is. Nothing but tourists seeking tourist attractions. I go to Treasure Beach to get away from commercialism. The long airport ride is a welcome escape route to the laid back and quaint Treasure Beach community. I say "NO" to seaplanes or even helicopters, for that matter too. Maybe Jason could find another place more suitable for development. Treasure Beach is a national Jamaican treasure, a beautiful community and lovely environment. It should stay that way. Once it's lost you can never get it back.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Willing to Fight on Sunday, March 15, 2009 - 06:57 am: Edit Post

I was so impressed by what Mrs. McCaulay said. There is progress that's positive, and there is progress that can cost us the treasure we love.

May God give us the wisdom to know the difference and the strength to fight for our convictions even if this is neither a fast or easy thing to do.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By we need help on Sunday, March 15, 2009 - 07:08 am: Edit Post

Hoping that Diana McCauley from JET and similar bodies of environmental sources will be able to help keep Treasure Beach from being developed and spoiled. and turning into another Negril. (of which the signs are already appearing)


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Thank-You on Sunday, March 15, 2009 - 04:16 pm: Edit Post

I am greatful Miss McCaulay has come to Treasure Beach. We may not wish to hear all she has to say because it will cause each of us to change some things. We may have to give up some of what we have to preserve our community for the future. If not we will be like Negril.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By A Friend on Monday, March 16, 2009 - 05:26 pm: Edit Post

I do not mean to make a pest of myself but I am looking for an honest answer. Are there beaches the owners don't allow you to walk on or to pass by their property. I thought all beaches were public. Am I wrong?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By American on Tuesday, March 17, 2009 - 03:03 pm: Edit Post

Look at how we ignored things in the United States until we poisoned the water and air and killed countless fish and animals, changed the weather for the worse, and more. You may envy some of what we have, but what YOU have is priceless. Please do not follow our bad example.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Seth on Tuesday, March 17, 2009 - 02:37 pm: Edit Post

According to everything I've read, all beaches in Jamaica are public beaches. That's why I laugh when I read ads for hotels that say their beach is private. Even in Negril, you can walk the length of 7-mile beach (ok, I've only walked about half the beach so far!), and no one can tell you you have no right to be there, meanwhile, most of those hotels and resorts say their beaches are private.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By native on Wednesday, March 18, 2009 - 05:05 pm: Edit Post

I sometimes listen a radio station out of St. Ann and heard the host of a Sunday morning show complaining that some of the beaches in that parish have been sold to private intetets.As I mentioned in a previous post some friends and myself were driven away from a spot in Fort Charles some years ago.

Can someone provide us with some clarification as to whether private beaches exist in Jamaica? Or some sources from which some information on the subject can be had ?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By freeman on Wednesday, March 18, 2009 - 10:19 pm: Edit Post

From what I get to understand, beaches are considered 'private' to the high water mark wherever that maybe. we have never had a problem in treasure beach where someone have blocked anyone to go on the beach. i hear that a new villa owner in Billy's Bay is trying to keep people off his beach. this should not be allow and those people that are affected should call the parish council to see what can be one. i only know the beaches in Treasure Beach to be free as long as anyone can remember. is this them call progress?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By TO FREEMAN on Thursday, March 19, 2009 - 01:06 pm: Edit Post

I don't think any villas in Billy's Bay have been sold. Which villa are you talking about?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By In the Know on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 04:03 am: Edit Post

Yes there's a new Villa or House in Billy's Bay on the land where the big guinape tree is, it used to be owned by Alva Clark, yes they have ran a wall into the sea but we'll see what the hurricane will do to it. The Heal's that used to owned Sparkling Waters used chase us from the beach even with guns when we where children it's their beach they said....thank God the new owner don't think so.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By No name on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 07:11 am: Edit Post

It is a new place - the one with the big fence and blue gate.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By freeman on Thursday, March 19, 2009 - 09:31 pm: Edit Post

it is two new villa on mr clarke land build by some people from abroad...they stop people from go on that beach now


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By In the Know on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 12:18 pm: Edit Post

Yes No Name it's the one with the big Blue gate.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Visitor on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 01:29 pm: Edit Post

We wanted to see them when we were last in Treasure Beach. Our driver suggested we didn't go inside the gates because there were guard dogs there. We didn't think that was unusual because maybe building materials would disappear when the workers weren't there, and the property inside the fence is private. We were not aware you could not walk on the beach BEHIND the wall.

This does not seem to be legal. Is it?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Connie on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 01:31 pm: Edit Post

If villa owners are mistakenly under the impression that they own the beach, is there someone in a position of local authority who could inform them that they don't, in fact, own the beach? If they are chasing people off the beach, they may not listen to a 'regular' person telling them that all beaches are public, but a local official could make the case plain.

And waiting to see what the hurricanes do to that wall may not be good enough. No hurricanes have taken down a certain unsightly wall that causes beach erosion over by Calabash Bay, and that wall has been standing a few years now. If the wall is extending beyond the property line, local officials need to approach the villa owners and have them take it down.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Rebecca on Sunday, March 22, 2009 - 07:20 am: Edit Post

I walked the beach in Billy's Bay on Friday and no one approached me. I did see the wall, but also saw a path worn around the wall where folks could pass. I asked several friends living in the area if they have heard of anyone being told to leave that beach lately and they said no.

I have also heard of previous incidents of folks being asked to leave this beach. However, let's hope this is all in the past and will not happen again.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Beaches for all on Monday, March 23, 2009 - 06:20 am: Edit Post

Good to know this Rebecca. Who owns those houses?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By interested on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 - 03:26 am: Edit Post

what does the law say about the public using those beaches ? any law people here to answer this ?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By NEPA?? on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 - 10:20 am: Edit Post

I think NEPA has a lot to say about the use of beaches, though Treasure Beach has fought to keep them away.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By JET on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 - 07:33 am: Edit Post

The foreshore - that is, the part of the land between high and low water marks is owned by the government, and if a landowner of land adjacent to the foreshore wants to do anything to the foreshore, including build a jetty or even a swimming raft, they need a permit from the GOJ. Further, the GOJ has issued permits for "private" beaches, although I don't think this has been done recently. My understanding is there is no specific right of access to beaches in Jamaica. I would like to ask Danielle, JET's attorney, to respond more fully on this, but she is travelling over the next day or so. I know it is not a simple situation. I also know that between 1998 to 2000, the GOJ developed a draft Beach policy, which enjoyed considerable public consultation, and this policy sought to formalize access to beaches for the Jamaican people. The tourism industry objected, called it "tourism suicide" and the beach policy has never been passed. JET has a Power Point presentation on the beach access issue - we have held public meetings on the subject - which could be shared with everyone in TB at any meeting we planned.

I am travelling from tomorrow, so will not be in touch (perhaps intermittently, who knows?) until April 22.
Diana


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Sue & Milt on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 - 11:51 am: Edit Post

We have been staying in Billy's Bay for the past month or so and we use the beach every day. There are concrete stairs that go down to the beach from a villa but I wouldn't say it's a wall. There's reef and rock at the bottom of the steps to go over but that's normal for the area. It's quite rocky in some parts.

Maybe people are confusing warnings about the danger of swimming in one particularly popular spot on the beach. There is a beautiful sandy beach area everyone loves that is very dangerous for swimming. The pull of the sea is very strong there and if you go out too far there is a serious and real danger of drowning.

The good people of some of the villas in that section of the beach will often come down and warn newcomers of the dangers but in all our time over the years in Billy's Bay, never have we ever been told to leave the beach. Only warned about the strong pull of the tides.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Danielle A. on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 - 03:33 pm: Edit Post

You are right Diana. The foreshore is owned by the government and a licence is needed to do anything commercial with it (eg hotel or public bathing beach) or to encroach on it by building anything. Although the law does not give a specific right of access to the general public, generally, the licences that I have seen granted to hotels, will state as a condition, that you should not restrict the public from accessing the foreshore so long as they are properly attired and not causing a nuisance (or something to that effect.)

I would just add that if any person or class of persons has been accessing a beach continuously and without interruption for 20 years or more then they can get a court order recognising that 'prescriptive right' to access the beach. You can either petition NEPA to do this for you or you can hire a lawyer and do it yourself. The folks in Winnifred Beach, Portland are currently in court with UDC over this issue.

The last thing I heard about the Beach Policy (sometime last year) is that it was being reviewed!


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Golden Sands on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 07:09 pm: Edit Post

Isn't the Golden Sands lawsuit something like this?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By turey on Thursday, March 26, 2009 - 01:37 pm: Edit Post

Interesting that the tourism industry considered free access to beaches by Jamaicans to be "tourism suicide".

I thought people came to Jamaica for the experience of the land and the people while cleansing in salt water and warming in the sun.

Are we so far gone that we cannot be trusted to be near the fariner dem?

Treasure Beach certainly has much to teach this industry.

The classification of tourism of an industry is indicative of the current process. Like mining, it involves finding the mother load and extracting as much as possible in as short a time as possible then dividing the spoils.

The eyes are on the spoils not the possible beauty of the process. It's own reward for the long term.

Hopefully a reclassification to something like 'Key Sustainable Enterprise' may happen.

Are my fellow dinosaurs listening?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Bowl on Thursday, March 26, 2009 - 08:05 pm: Edit Post

Turey this dinosaur is listening, watching and defending my beautiful dinosaurium.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By interested on Friday, March 27, 2009 - 08:49 am: Edit Post

TUREY, please can we have a source or something for what you´re saying about... "the tourism industry considered free access to beaches by Jamaicans to be "tourism suicide"....
that devastating, mon...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By mnken on Friday, March 27, 2009 - 01:08 pm: Edit Post

My feeling is this stems from places like Negril. I remember toward the end of my years visiting there, what I would describe as 'scary' when approached by dozens of people at one time, in your face trying to sell everything form drugs to wood carvings to a female escort. And a polite 'no thanks' was responded with scorn and cursing. I love Jamaica. But that got to be 'unrelaxing' for me. If it were not for Treasure Beach, I would have found some other tropical place to spend my vacations.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By turey on Friday, March 27, 2009 - 09:46 pm: Edit Post

Ms McCauley included this in her post above Interested. The fact that visitors are free to mingle and are protected and taught during their stay in TB is one of the most valuable treasures we have in our 'dinosaurium' (thanks Bowl).

I know there is much ginnalship etc in other places that give the tourism industry worry. I can only hope we retain our openess in TB and become a lesson in what many visitors really want.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By preserve on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 08:42 am: Edit Post

Once again yet another visitor to Treasure Beach yesterday expressed her love for the area and how she and her family appreciated the quiet community, buying fish and veg. from local vendors, the feeling of safety, etc ... but also voiced her concern of it becoming spoilt and over-developed. She and her family hope to return every year from europe, and rent a house. However, is hesitant as she "hears" about possible seaplane landings several times a day, reef being dynamited, big sports complex (and what element of people that would bring into the area) etc.
Please let us try and preserve what is precious about our little community.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Think about it on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 06:15 pm: Edit Post

If people do not realize and appreciate and help save the good things we have, we could have many more "progressive" things (i.e., sports park) and very little progress.

More is not always better.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Deana on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 03:15 pm: Edit Post

We haven't heard any more from either Stepup or Villa Owner. They both said such good things. I would like to hear more from them.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By mamacatb on Sunday, April 26, 2009 - 09:44 am: Edit Post

It's been a long time since my last post. I was curious to see what was going on in regard to environmental issues, sea planes, etc. now I read about a wall on the beach in Billy's Bay. To me this is incomprehensible. There is plenty enough beach for All to share. Why are walls necessary? Treasure Beach is so friendly, inviting and beautiful. The whole wonder of Treasure Beach is the lack of crowds and tourist attractions. One goes to Treasure Beach to escape... Walls are not what I want to talk about but I did find the wall curious. I just want to make my point again that Treasure Beach is a Jamaican treasure that the kind people there let "outsiders" share. I am very grateful for their generosity to tourists. I do pray that commercialism and greed does not overtake their free offering of kindness and generosity. If the quiet, quaintness of this paradise is lost, Paradise will indeed be Lost forever...


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By I Care. Do U? on Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 05:58 pm: Edit Post

This is why so many of us would like Jamaica for Sale to be shown to as many people as possible in Treasure Beach. Negril is already ruined, as are so many other places in Jamaica. We cannot allow this to happen to us. People must wake up before it is too late to fix things.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By yes i care on Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 06:40 pm: Edit Post

Diana McCauley and some of her team are hoping to bring the film "Jamaica For Sale" to Treasure Beach for a viewing .. possibly in early June. Think its important for many in the community to take the time to watch it.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By turey on Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 06:22 pm: Edit Post

I believe Ms McCauly is willing to show Jamaica for Sale.

When did she say she would be in Ja again and available to come to TB?


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By I Care. Do U? on Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 06:55 pm: Edit Post

I recall beginning of May for her return.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By iwannasee on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 07:24 am: Edit Post

How can someone get their hands on this film? I would love to watch it. I live in the US. I looked at the website, but didn't see anyplace to purchase.


Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message  By Film in the U.S. on Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 12:36 pm: Edit Post

Because of rights to something - maybe the music - this film cannot be sent to the U.S., maybe not outside of Jamaica at all.